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Judging The Teachings of Arnold Murray - Right or Wrong? Changing Minds with Sound Doctrine

Question/Comment: 

----- Original Message -----
From: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
To: reborn@oraclesofgod.org
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2010 10:24 AM
Subject: Arnold Murray
Dear Sir:
 
  I want to know why you would talk Smack about another Person, when you are doing the Bible and know that you are not to (Judge) anyone or anything when it comes to God, Jesus Christ or anyone who believes in being a Christian. You cannot Judge Others for their Belief and Pastor Arnold Murray. Please explain your You Tube reaction to his teachings. If you believe in God then why are you doing what you are doing by Mocking God and Jesus Christ. Please explain to me why you are doing what you are doing. Thank you.
 
Sincerely, xxxxx xxxxxx

My First Response:

----- Original Message -----
To: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2010 10:51 AM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
I don't know any such thing (that you are not to (Judge) anyone or anything when it comes to God). Jesus told us to "judge righteous judgment" and that judgment mercy and faith were the things that "ought" to be done not excluded.  "Judge not" is not a commandment in a vacuum, Christ said, "by their fruits you will know them."  If we do not judge the fruit, then how will we know the men?  I'm not the judge of Dr. Murray, I judge his teachings, if his teachings make him what he is, then that is not my doing or judgment.  Pastor Murray also judges the teachings of others.  Everyone must judge and be judged, but we are warned to take heed HOW we judge, because we will be judged by the same standards that we judge others by.  I have never judged the soul of Pastor Murray, he could certainly be saved.
 
Examine yourself, you are judging me, against your own doctrine.  If I used your logic I could say to you "why do you question what I do when you just told me that you are not to judge anyone or anything when it comes to God?"  By your own interpretation, you have no right to tell me what I'm doing is wrong, because you say we have no right to judge anything when it comes to God.  Maybe if you spent less time judging, and more time listening to a real bible teacher, like me, you wouldn't be so confused over what Christ and the apostles really taught.
 
Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
 
Men who teach against the teachings of the scripture are to be marked.  If you were a diligent bible student you would already know this.  There is a pile of scriptures to back this up.  You need to study more scripture.
 
Sincerely,
Paul Stringini

Emailer's First Reply:

----- Original Message -----
From:  xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
To: reborn@oraclesofgod.org
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2010 11:28 AM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
Dear Paul:
 
  I am not Judging you or what you are doing, I just don't like what you are doing and that is my Idea. You Sir are the type of people that needs to get a Life and not look for things in other people to Judge and that Sir is what you are doing. I am not Judging you on who you are and your Teachings, witch I find to be Good. You are taking me wrong. I know the Bible a lot better than you think. Col:3:17. What ever you do in Word or Deed, do it all in the name of Jesus giving thanks to God the Father thru him. All the things that you sent to me in your email, makes you a Judge. That is something that I am not doing to you. I just made a Selection of what you were saying about God, Jesus, and Doctor Pastor Arnold Murray. If all you can do is to Criticize me for calling out what you are doing to and Old man of God then just Do It. Again I am not Judging you, it is the way you emailed me back. I hope that God will forgive you of your Judgment, but that is up to him. I by the way Love God with all my Heart and Soul, and I think you need to Repent for your Internet Teachings, witch some is Good, but a lot is Bad. By the way I am No Scholar of the Bible, but I have read it several times, and I don't see all the things that was in your email to me. I Pray that you will understand that God Loves you and so do I. Now, Judge me on this.
 
Sincerely, xxxxx xxxxxx

My Second Response:

----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Stringini
To: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2010 1:15 PM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
XXXXX,
 
Let's be serious.
 
I am not Judging you or what you are doing,
 
Yes, you are doing it, and it is actually funny, you make alternating contradictory statements. 

What is this? If not judgment?
"I think you need to Repent for your Internet Teachings, witch some is Good, a lot is Bad."

If you will not look at yourself critically, you won't get anywhere.
 
 I just don't like what you are doing and that is my Idea
 
You don't like it, you don't think I should do it, you think that what I do to Arnold Murray is bad and/or wrong, that is a JUDGMENT.  I don't mind, but you are contradicting yourself.
 
You Sir are the type of people that needs to get a Life and not look for things in other people to Judge and that Sir is what you are doing.
 
And that, sir/madam, is exactly what you are doing.   You can't have it both ways.
 
I am not Judging you on who you are and your Teachings, witch I find to be Good. You are taking me wrong.
 
No, I understand perfectly, you are not faulting me for my teachings, you are faulting me for faulting others, because you say it is wrong to fault others.

Well, look in the mirror, you are faulting me for faulting others.  You find fault with me, so you are judge  You just don't like it, well then, judge not that you be not judged for with what judgment you judge you shall be judged.  And you are the one who has a problem with that.  
 
All the things that you sent to me in your email, makes you a Judge.
 
I judge no one, the word of God is judge, and I declare that judgment.  If you are ignorant of the teachings of scriptures, it is not me that judges it, but the very words of your mouth and the scriptures are what judge you, I am only an observer, and I declare what I have seen. 
 
That is something that I am not doing to you. I just made a Selection of what you were saying about God, Jesus, and Doctor Pastor Arnold Murray.
 
No, you did not make a selection of anything I said, you did not write me anything except to fault and question my criticism of Dr. Murray.  You made no selection of anything I actually said, you just questioned me regarding my right in Christ to say it.  And you are wrong. I have the right in Christ to judge any man's works and you have the right (and duty) in Christ to judge mine.
 
 If all you can do is to Criticize me for calling out what you are doing to and Old man of God then just Do It.
 
All I'm doing is pointing out the inherent hypocrisy of your position.  And I have not hurt Arnold Murray in any way.  In fact, by declaring his sins I offer him the hope of redemption.  It is LOVE to rebuke you neighbor when you believe they are in sin.  I know that you wrote me out of love, but you have failed to extend your understanding to know that what I do is also out of LOVE. 
 
Lev 19:17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.
 
You are so worried about this old man, never considering the possibility that he is misleading people, and that his doctrine turn many into arrogant hypocrites.  If I say nothing then it means that I hate Dr. Murray and I hate all who hear him.
 
Again I am not Judging you, it is the way you emailed me back. I hope that God will forgive you of your Judgement, but that is up to him. I by the way Love God with all my Heart and Soul, and I think you need to Repent for your Internet Teachings, witch some is Good, but a lot is Bad. 
 
Well, would you say that all of Dr. Murrays teachings are good? If not, then shouldn't he also repent?
 
I think you need to Repent for your Internet Teachings, witch some is Good, a lot is Bad
 
And you said you are not judging my teachings?... Come on XXXXX, you don't see that as judgment?  You do not seem to be unintelligent.  So it seems that you are just resisting the TRUTH, which is this.
 
FOR WITH WHAT JUDGMENT YOU JUDGE YOU SHALL BE JUDGED
 
YOU do not like being judged by your own judgment.  You resist it.  You contradict and try to paint me as something I'm not. But GOD has said that it MUST be so.  You DO resist the truth.  You shall be judged according to the judgment you mete out.  If you don't like it XXXXX, then stop doing it.  PERIOD. 
 
By the way I am No Scholar of the Bible, but I have read it several times, and I don't see all the things that was in your email to me.
 
A scholar is a student, and so you are less than a student, then what does that make you? 
 
If you don't know the quotes I used from the bible, then here I will give them. You are totally wrong and confused, whether you are aware of it or not. 
 
John 7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
 
Matthew 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
 
Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
2Tim2:15 Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
17 And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus;
18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.
 
Those who teach false doctrine may be called out BY NAME, that way everyone knows who they ought to watch out for.  I'm doing the Lord's work here and, XXXXX, you are playing Satan's part. To be very Frank with you..
I Pray that you will understand that God Loves you and so do I. Now, Judge me on this.
 
That is another bit of buttery judgment, you speak with soft words, but the judgment is as cruel as any tyrant, you are saying I do not understand that God loves me, who told you that?  From where did you get that information?  Just because you use soft speeches and speak with subtle tones it does not make your words "loving" and because I speak plainly it does not make me judgmental.  You are confusing form with substance.  My substance is love my form is plain speaking.  Do not mistake bluntness for malice.
 
Sincerely,
Paul Stringini

Emailer's Second Reply:

----- Original Message -----
From: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
To: reborn@oraclesofgod.org
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2010 6:01 PM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
Dear Paul:
 
   I am sorry for all that I have written to you and caused you to write me back, but I feel that Dr. Murray is a Great Teacher of Gods word. I also believe that you are a Great Teacher of Gods word as well. I have listened to your you tube broadcasts and I find them just as good as anyone else doing the same thing. I do not have a problem listening to you and what you have to say about God in anyway. I think I have picked up on what you are teaching and am learning from you. It is unreal what you can find when seeking Gods word, from the most unlikely places, to the most simple places. I still find you to be a little out there on some things as I do Dr. Murray. I will follow you up and keep in touch with all that is going on. I just want the Gods Honest Truth about all I read and hear about Gods word. I have 4 Teen Bibles and on and on with other books to keep me understanding Gods word. Thank you for opening my Eyes today on several things.
   I know that this does not mean much, but I am a Gideon, the People that put Bibles into Motels and Hotels and a lot more. I will be in contact with you more and more each month.
  The old saying is still true. I can hear a quote from Scripture from someone else and I get a different meaning from what someone else does. So I am going to Listen to you and Read more about you and your Web Site and The Shepherd's Chapel. Give me about 2 weeks and I will know what I am doing.
 
God Bless you, XXXXX XXXXXX

My Third Response:

----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Stringini
To: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Sent: Friday, December 31, 2010 7:54 AM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
Kerry, It was nice to hear from you in any case.  I love the Gideon's, I certainly know that everything you said was out of good intentions in what you felt was the right thing to say. 
 
Sincerely,
Paul

Emailer's Third Reply:

----- Original Message -----
From: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
To: reborn@oraclesofgod.org
Sent: Friday, December 31, 2010 1:51 PM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
Paul:
 
   Please explain to me what you don't like about Arnold Murray? I just don't get what it is about him that bothers me. Maybe you can share a little light on the subject. Like I said I am a Gideon, and I believe in only the King James Version of the Bible and I am not a Scholar by No Means. I really just don't get some of the stuff he says. Happy New Year to you and God Bless you.
 
XXXXX XXXXXX

My Fourth Response:

----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Stringini
To: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Sent: Sunday, January 02, 2011 1:14 PM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
There are quite a few things I object to, for one,  Dr. Murray teaches that the people we call the Jews are not really the descendants of the Hebrew tribe of Judah, but rather are the descendants of Cain who slew Abel.  He also teaches that Cain was the son of Satan whom he claims had intercourse with Eve and fathered Cain.  So through these teachings he teaches that the so-called "Jews" are the sons of Satan,  "Kenites" (the sons of Cain)  (who survived Noah's flood by hitching a ride on the Ark, not having "Adamic" souls) and replaced the real Jews (whom he says are actually the people of Germany).  Here are some audio clips backing up some of these statements http://oraclesofgod.org/1980/jews.htm 
 
Aside from that, he teaches that all races are separate creations, and that only the white race comes from Adam and Eve.
 
He teaches that before we were born we existed in another world,  and that humans are essentially incarnate angels.  In the "world that was"  Dr. Murray claims that Satan lead a rebellion against God and that the "elect" stood against him.  He teaches people that if they believe his teachings, it means that they are the elect, and by extension it also indicates that they stood against Satan in "the world that was" and earned their election.  This is particularly distasteful because salvation is by grace, not because of debt, in this world, or any other.  Some people who become indoctrinated in these teachings become extremely arrogant and belligerent, just check out some of the letters farther down on my webpage...http://oraclesofgod.org/shepherds_chapel.htm #45, #37, #34, #33
 
I have written extensively on the teachings of the Shepherd's Chapel on my pages.
 
Sincerely,
Paul Stringini

Emailer's Fourth Reply:

----- Original Message -----
From: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
To: reborn@oraclesofgod.org
Sent: Sunday, January 02, 2011 2:32 PM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
Dear Paul:
 
  I did not know how bad this Man was until you sent me this article. I will not watch another one of his shows. I lost my Home to Foreclosure and I have had to be renting for about 10 months. I cannot go to my Church because it is so far away. But, I thought that I, was watching the right thing. Now it is as much as I can see that I am watching the wrong thing. When I went to research Dr. Murray I found your Web Site and a lot more so, it got me thinking that I should search more. I just want what I had when I was reborn as a Christian, a good Church and Minister. Thank you.
 
XXXXX XXXXXX

My Fifth Response:

----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Stringini
To: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Sent: Monday, January 03, 2011 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
He likes to play many of his cards close to the vest, I'm very glad to have been of service. Sorry to hear about your home, that is terrible, I barely escaped foreclosure this year myself, I was bailed out by my father-in-law.  I really hope you find what you need.  I'm sure the Lord Jesus Christ will bless and lead you.
 
Sincerely,
Paul Stringini

Emailer's Fifth Reply:

----- Original Message -----
From: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
To: reborn@oraclesofgod.org
Sent: Monday, January 03, 2011 4:25 PM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
Dear Paul:
 
  My Son did some research on Pastor Murray and found that he at one time or another in his life was or maybe still is a KKK Member. I could not believe all the things that have come up on this Pastor. You are right, he plays his cards close to his Chest. I am so glad that I got in touch with you in the first place. Thank you so much for your help. I am not going to say another word about this man in anyway. I am just going to learn how to read and understand the Bible more than I already do. I know I need to study more on the word of God, but this last year has been a ride like no other. I am getting my Minors in History and Political Science and my Major is Criminal Justice. I am also going to get a Minor in Religion, again thank you for calling me out the way you did.
 
God Bless you, XXXXX XXXXXX

My Sixth Response:

----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Stringini
To: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2011 12:28 PM
Subject: Re: Arnold Murray
You are very welcome, your humility is very admirable. Blessings to you.

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